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• extra-curriculars From: ravishri  Apr 13, 2010 Posts 11

  Hi, In my college, we were not given certificates for certain extra-curricular activities that I had done, such as playing guitar in music fests, etc. I would, however, like to include this information in my application. I woudl like to know whether I need to have proof of the same(such as a letter from the college principal - getting which will take a good amount of effort since i have been out of college for about 4.5 yrs now) during the interview process in order to validate my claims. Ravi Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: Fanaticalfan  Apr 14, 2010 Posts 1,065

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  If an activity is important to, include it in the text of the application. Adcom do not want to wade through pages and pages of certificates and letters, and generally ask that you do NOT send in additional materials beyond those asked for in the application itself. FF Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: ravishri  Apr 14, 2010 Posts 11

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  hi FF, Thnx again Ravi Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 28, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  I am not sure if mruther87's post is just spam (or, frankly, what exactly is meant by a "signature campaign). That being said, I would strongly advise AGAINST providing extraneous documentation proving your involvement in extra-curriculars. Wharton, through a third-party, conducts background checks, and that is the process by which substantive application claims will be verified. Regards, Victor M. Lee Class of 2011 Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: lal  Apr 28, 2010 Posts 24

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  hi Victor as you said "Wharton, through a third-party, conducts background checks, and that is the process by which substantive application claims will be verified" is it possible for Wharton to check every candidate while initial scanning ? and i have another question that why wharton and other top business schools require a lot details on application forms like organization Hr numbers, if available, parents information and number of employees of organization whr experience was earned? i have seen many notes on this wharton discussion forum about adcom policy of selecting candidates but no one student of wharton has been able to clarify criteria so, shall we rely solely on LUCK? Regards, Lal Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 28, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  Lal, I can only speak to my experience going through the background check, which was outsourced to Kroll, last year. I found them to be very thorough. HR numbers are often requested so that those conducting background checks can verify dates of employment, positions, responsibilities, etc. Data on one's parents may serve varying purposes (for example, one's parents' level of education could provide some insight into where education might lie in a family's list of priorities; this can be useful information for providing a context within which to understand an application). The comments provided in this forum are intended to provoke reflection on what might be important aspects to address in an application. Naturally, no student will be able to clarify exactly what criteria are used in selecting candidates for admission because the process is, in a way, more art than science. While there are some qualitatively-described criteria that should be obvious (ability to handle rigorous academic coursework, demonstrated leadership ability/potential, etc.), there isn't a fixed scale against which candidates are assessed. A lot of it depends on how an overall application package is perceived, and how that application package compares to those of the other people who apply in a given year. AdCom does not seek just to tick off boxes against some set of objective qualification criteria, but to think of the applicant as a unique individual and how they would fit as a piece in the puzzle of a diverse, engaging class. To some extent, yes, there is an element of luck. As applicants, we cannot control who else applies. But I would contend that the vast majority of the application process is under your control (how you choose to put your application together, where and how you choose to interview, how much you do in research into Wharton, how much introspection you perform, how well you do on standardized tests and previous academic coursework, how effective and accomplished you are in your career and extra-curricular activities, etc.). Regards, Victor M. Lee Class of 2011 Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 28, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  Additionally, Lal, I understand that you have been looking for "strategies" to get into Wharton. I admire this dedication and enthusiasm. That being said, instead of thinking of the application process as just a game to be strategically "solved," try thinking about the process more as an opportunity to identify what you want to share with AdCom. A strategy that works well for one applicant may completely backfire for an applicant with a different background and set of experiences/qualifications. I suspect that those who are most successful in the application process have spent more time thinking about the strategy of how to position themselves in the best possible light than on identifying "tricks" for gaming the system. There is, perhaps, some subtlely in the difference, here. But understanding that subtlety is, in my opinion, critical to improving your odds in the application process. Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: lal  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 24

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  Hi Victor Thank you for taking out your precious time to reply my queries. I can understand what you said. i have also drawn a conclusion from all communications i have made on this forum that it is very important that how a candidate present oneself isn't it? For that last year 2 years i have been working and the only reason i worked was to gain experience and understand corporate world so that i can have my MBA from Wharton or other top Business school. 1st job i did was in insurance industry for 8 months then 2nd in banking industry for 17 months (till now) and the 3rd one that capital market which i am interested to join and making my experience of more than 3 years on aug 1 2011, as required in Wharton Application, how do you see a candidate like me with 3 jobs? i can understand you are going to refuse to comment on it, as you have already to other potential candidate, but what i want to know is that u must have seen many candidates in wharton of different profiles so u must have at least idea. Do u think Adcom will consider it as -ve or +ve? in addition to that i want to share that i consider my journey of jobs as education till i do my Wharton MBA not the work. i will consider job as job after doing my MBA from Wharton. LAL Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  Hi, LAL, My pleasure. I was in your shoes not so long ago. I understand how challenging the application process can feel at times. First, a clarification. Wharton's MBA program does NOT require three years of work experience, as you seem to suggest. That being said, I believe that, on average, those with work experience may have an easier time applying because they have a larger body of experience from which to draw when writing their essays. As for the three job question, the number of jobs is not the main issue. What is important is what types of jobs you assumed, how they fit into your overall career goals, why you chose to change jobs/industries, etc.  There is no particular number of jobs that a candidate must or must not have had. I hope this provides more clarity. It is not an issue of me not wanting to comment on your question. It is that, with all due respect, the question is not relevant when thought of as a pure numbers issue (i.e. - "What is the right number of jobs to have had?" is the wrong way to go about thinking about this). Hope this makes more sense. Please kindly clarify what you mean by +/- VE. Good luck in your application! Best, Victor Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: lal  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 24

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  what i meant anout +ve / -ve was negative can be job switcher or candidate is not clear positive can be diverse experience which i think is my strength because i have done Bachelor in business administration BBA in finance and all these jobs *** under financial sector Lal Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  I'll also add this thought (which is necessarily imperfect, as I don't have the full context of an entire application package off of which to comment). You pointed out that you changed jobs/industries twice after eight months and 17 months on your first two jobs. This is an interesting example of how framing can be significant. Make sure you clarify how this rapid industry switching fits into your career history and career goals (if applicable). -Victor Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: lal  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 24

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  can u clarify "This is an interesting example of how framing can be significant" ? Lal Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  Sure. One more positive way of framing rapid career/industry switches is to explain them as a means of career exploration and gaining appreciation for one's own interests and strengths. Another positive way of framing this history is, as you mentioned, positioning it as a diverse set of experiences (be careful, though, as some who are more skeptical might wonder if you really are getting a diverse experience if you have been on a job for less than, say, a year). A more negative way of framing the same phenomenon would be to say (as some employers might) that the individual is a hiring risk, especially if the employer is looking for a steady, reliable individual from whom they can recoup their training investment. One "admissions corollary" to this more negative view would be: "Hmm...does this individual know what they want, and do they perhaps not have a clear sense of career direction that would enable them to make the most of their MBA experience?" Thus, at the end of the day, it is how you position your background that can be more impactful than the actual experience itself, I would argue. -Victor Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: lal  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 24

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  your suggesttions are really valuable for me.  have u seen anybody of same jobs situation? Lal Reply

• Re: extra-curriculars From: victormlee  Apr 29, 2010 Posts 2,142

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  Not off the top of my head, but there are many people who have gone to Wharton. The odds are high that a frequent career switcher has attended Wharton in recent years. Keep in mind, though, that this is just one of many data points, so a comparison just on job experience would likely be misleading. -Victor Reply